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Thread: Perry Stone & Hades

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    Default Perry Stone & Hades

    Perry Stone's Mistake About Hades & Heaven

    Perry Stone thinks when "the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose" (Matt. 27.52) this meant Abraham's bosom (the good side of Hades, the place of sleep before resurrection and where Jesus went when He died) no longer exists. But the Bible say "and death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire" (Rev. 20.14) which is to say it has not happened yet since this happens at the end of the millennial kingdom (vv.2-7). Surely some people were raised from the dead in Matt. 27.52 to show the power of His death on the cross, but not all the Saints of the Most High. Israel would have been so overcrowded.

    We are going to be "caught up together" (1 Thess. 4.17) at the consummation of this age either at the start (Rev. 7.19) of the last week or at the "last trumpet" (1 Thess. 4.16, 1 Cor. 15.23,52). The Bible does not say the Saints return with Christ to get newly clothed bodies, then get raptured, and then return with Him again. That is silly. Christ only returns once.

    Perry thinks Paul's experience in 1 Cor. 12.2-4 of his third heaven experience is more than his being raised in spirit like John's. Yet Paul says "whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth" (v.2). Paul did not die at Lystra, fourteen years prior 14 when this happened, but mistaken men were "supposing he had been dead" (Acts 14.9).

    The Paradise above is Third Heaven. There is also the paradise below, which is where we sleep to await our newly clothed resurrected bodies. They are two different places.

    Perry Totally Overlooks 2nd Heaven

    Perry also believes there are three heavens, but he is wrong about what those three heavens are. He calls one heaven the earth, the second the stars and the third the third heaven. He has has split the earth and the stars as two heavens even though they are the same creation, when the Bible treats them as only one heaven. He says his evidence is Isaiah 14, "For you said to yourself, `I will ascend to heaven and set my throne above God's stars" (v.13). Yet this verses says there is an abode above the stars (third heaven) and the abode of the stars. The stars and earth are first heaven, third heaven is where the throne is, and 2nd heaven would be where? When Satan was cast out of 3rd heaven, he was thrown down to 2nd heaven where he traverses 1st heaven to and from as the god of this world.

    Perry Goes Before the High Priest Naked

    How does Perry try to resolve in his view of 1 Thess. 4.15-17 about not allowing those who are alive and left to precede those who have died? He says it is by them coming back from 3rd heaven to be given newly clothed bodies. This is so wrong though since "the dead in Christ shall rise first" (v.16). They are dead, that is, they are resting in timeless unawares of Abraham's bosom where the repentant thief is.

    And get this: "not prevent them which are asleep" (v.15). They are asleep. They have not been raised to 3rd heaven already as Perry says. Perry is a false teacher and to the day he dies, he will never repent of what he believes on this issue. He is committed to the path he has already gone down along with his false tongues of gibberish babble. He has said many times on his program, he will never change his mind.

    Brothers and sisters, even though a man boasts of his 40,000+ hours of study, know that he still needs to receive authentic life to be saved. We shall know them by their fruit which includes their false teaching.

    Do you know which verse says none shall come before the high priest naked? That is to say, none shall be raptured to third heaven or to the air until they have been given a newly clothed spiritual body.

    Perry Confuses the Gathering of the Remnant Israel with the Rapture of the Saints

    There is a reason why Perry confuses the gathering of Israel at the end of the Great Tribulation for the rapture of the saints before the Tribulation. It is to change the rapture at the last trumpet to the front of the Tribulation so that first rapture is not according to readiness and his conscience becomes insensitive to the need to "overcometh" to receive the reward of the crown that overcomer believers receive.

    "All the tribes on earth [of Israel]... angels shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other" (Matt. 24.30-31). Whereas the rapture of the saints is referred to at Matt. 24.40-41, and God calls us to be watchful in verse 42 to be one of those that are "taken" at first rapture and not "left". Both the taken and the left here are referring to Christians who have eternal life which can never be lost.

    Perry Assumes Paul Provided No Detail of the Last Trumpet

    Perry assumes since Revelation was not written till 95 AD that Paul would not give any details about the trumpets of the Tribulation. Should we assume this? Can we find evidence otherwise? If Matthew gives us details about those believers who are going to be "taken" and believers who pass through the Tribulation (the "left") in Matthew 24 for not being ready, then why wouldn't Paul give us some details about the timing of the raptures as well? Luke provides us information about a first rapture according to readiness (Luke 21.36) too to add to precede the rapture of the last trumpet.

    Some argue that according to I Thessalonians 4.15, the living “shall in no wise precede them who are fallen asleep” -The dead are resurrected at the seventh trumpet; and so timewise, rapture occurs after the Tribulation. Now if there is a first rapture, it will have to take place before the resurrection of the dead. But since this verse distinctly says “shall in no wise,” how then can rapture take place twice? Let me say in reply that it is most precious and significant to find in both verse 15 and verse 17 the qualifying clauses “we that are alive, that are left” - Now to be alive is obviously to be left on earth; why, then, is there this apparent unnecessary repetition? Because it implies that there are people who though alive yet have already gone ahead (that is, raptured) and therefore are no longer left on earth. Would Paul enlist himself among this class of people who are alive and are left? Not at all. He uses the word “we” only because he is speaking at that moment of writing, and the proof of this is that since Paul no longer lives today, he cannot be numbered among those who are left on earth. Our summary conclusion to all this is that the third school of interpretation seems to be the correct one - that is to say, that one group of believers will be raptured before the Tribulation while another group of believers will go through the Tribulation and be raptured afterwards.

    By reading Matthew 24.42 together with 1 Thessalonians 5.2, 4, it is evident that there are at least two raptures: for note that the first passage suggests rapture before the Tribulation because one must be watchful since he does not know when his Lord will come; while the second passage suggests rapture after the Tribulation because one knows when the day of the Lord shall come.

    The places to be raptured towards are also different. Whereas Revelation 7.15 mentions to “the throne of God” and Luke 21.36 mentions “to stand before the Son of man”, 1 Thessalonians 4.17 says that it is to “the air” – Such distinctions would thus indicate that the entire body of believers is not raptured all at one time.

    Even Mark gives us a comparison of the first rapture and the last trumpet rapture:

    Mark 13 states, “But of that day or that hour knoweth no one, not even the angels in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father” (v.32), So that the day of the coming of Christ is unknown. But 1 Thessalonians 4 declares that “the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God” (v.16). From this second passage we know that the appearing of Christ is after the sounding of the seventh trumpet. And hence the first passage relates to pre-tribulation rapture while the second relates to post-tribulation rapture.

    God's Lock Tumblers

    It is important to note the lock tumblers to unlock the lock of the book of Revelation is to realize the last seal opens the 7 trumpets of the Tribulation and the last trumpet pours out the 7 bowls. In view of this original perspective, we would also realize that Revelation 12 to 19 give the details of the major points of Rev. 6 to 11. Do note that the first 5 seals have been completed and we are in the 6th seal which is almost finished. Daniel's last seven begins with the 7th seal broken.

    Enoch and Elijah

    One might still ask where did Enoch, Elijah and those who were resurrected at Matt. 27.52 go? Enoch and Elijah would not have received new bodies yet since they have yet to die as the two witnesses. And they can't go before the high priest naked, since they did not go to third heaven. We must conclude they have been saved in some separate dimension with their bodies intact to return to die. They would still have their physical bodies and you can't get to third heaven in physical bodies. Those at Matt. 27.52 were given newly clothed resurrected bodies and then would have been raptured. However, we are going to third heaven together, so they would be held some place as well to be raised to third heaven with those who are asleep in hades, and those who are alive and left.

    It sounds complicated but there is no other logical possibility.


    Negative Consequences for Perry

    Not only will Perry not receive the crown to return with Christ to reign in the millennial kingdom or be raptured at first rapture, I for one can not even be convinced he is saved.

    If he thinks saints are already in heaven, then he forsakes our being raised together. There is a party going on already so that if you die now you get to join the party beforehand. This may inadvertendly cause you to seek death now.

    And since first rapture is not according to readiness, this too lowers his conscience to not seek after the prize. He will enter the Tribulation, not realize it it is the Tribulation to take the mark of the beast, for he will always assume whatever the tribulation may be it certainly can't be the Tribulation otherwise he pridefully thinks he would have been raptured.

    Let us not forget false tongues. Since the Bible does not any cause refer to tongues as gibberish babble, then this alteration is for Perry's emotion to confuse the soul for the spirit. Only confusion and deception can arise from this!

    Borrowed forgiveness means a believer can not believe someone is a Christian without seeing the fruit. They borrow God's forgiveness to forgive someone, thus not overassuming someone is saved. We do not just believe someone is a Christian blindly.

    Perhaps the Worse Teaching of All

    The worse teaching of all is filthly lucre, aligning himself to the world, operating just as they do. Advertising on tv, and selling products in the name of God for your dollars. His excitement to all the meetings he is going to is a direct effect of knowing the revenues he will generate from those actions.

    People say, doesn't he have to make a living? Yes. If he needs to make a living then he should go work at McDonalds if he is hard up for cash. All the products he sells, like Adrian Rogers, is done in sin, like a Balaam. Balaam was a covetous Old Testament prophet who preached for the sake of money.

    What Do I Come Away With This?

    What do I come away with apparently wasting my time watching this program? When you find a false teacher, know quickly enough to avoid him, and move on. Don't keep noticing his errors, for this man will never repent of his sins. He will only drag you down to his level. You may even try to pull him up onto the table with you by trying to help him, but don't you realize that he is pulling back so hard that he might topple the table over and you with it so that you will lose your crown (reward of reigning in the millennial kingdom)?

    In Perry Stone's latest program he considered certain Song of Songs verses as being the rapture when they were not about the rapture, but a deeper inner relationship with the Lord. Perry is too shallow and error prone for any Christian in his lofty position.

  2. #2
    Isaac Guest

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    You are perfectly correct in that gibberish babble is not a "tongue" by any means. However, just because you do not understand it does not mean it must NOT be a tongue. If someone says something you do not understand, and someone else understands it perfectly, then there is clearly a good communication at work.

    Let's say you do not understand Hindi, and become frustrated because everyone around speaks Hindi, yet you can't speak a word. Is Hindi suddenly not a language because it sounds like gibberish to you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Isaac View Post
    You are perfectly correct in that gibberish babble is not a "tongue" by any means. However, just because you do not understand it does not mean it must NOT be a tongue. If someone says something you do not understand, and someone else understands it perfectly, then there is clearly a good communication at work. Let's say you do not understand Hindi, and become frustrated because everyone around speaks Hindi, yet you can't speak a word. Is Hindi suddenly not a language because it sounds like gibberish to you?
    When someone says they are speaking in tongues and it is just gibberish babble baby talk (not tongues), you can prove this by asking what they just said means. If neither they can interpret it as a language or another interpreter cannot interpret it and be verified by interpreters with the same interpretation, you know it is just kindergarten mediums. This is the true test. And at the very least the speaker of a language you don't know would at least be able to say what the name of that language is. If they can not even do this, you know they are fraudulent; they are under the spell of an alteration of God's Word.

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